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	<title>Comments on: Imagine yourself voting.  Preferably on Paper.</title>
	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/</link>
	<description>Random samplings from a universe of ideas.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 04:30:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: schustenberg</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21898</link>
		<dc:creator>schustenberg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Nov 2006 12:36:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21898</guid>
		<description>I feel that the basic idea of those "scientific" electoral spots is: we are scientist, we know what is right for you. I think that everone who is really inside science would honestly adimit that being maybe "smarter" (as the spot says) than other people (and even this is at least opinable!), does not mean that we are more qualyfied than others in dealing with crucial issues such as embryo stem research. It is not "science" which must decide what is right or not to pursue...it's a responsability of the whole society. If we -scientists- do not defend this principle you can easily see the frankenstein-ish nightmare where this path could end (as it has already ended in some circumstances of human history).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel that the basic idea of those &#8220;scientific&#8221; electoral spots is: we are scientist, we know what is right for you. I think that everone who is really inside science would honestly adimit that being maybe &#8220;smarter&#8221; (as the spot says) than other people (and even this is at least opinable!), does not mean that we are more qualyfied than others in dealing with crucial issues such as embryo stem research. It is not &#8220;science&#8221; which must decide what is right or not to pursue&#8230;it&#8217;s a responsability of the whole society. If we -scientists- do not defend this principle you can easily see the frankenstein-ish nightmare where this path could end (as it has already ended in some circumstances of human history).</p>
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		<title>By: mark</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21899</link>
		<dc:creator>mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Nov 2006 22:45:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21899</guid>
		<description>I thought the old booths, with the curtains and the levers, were reliable, if clunky and low-tech. But I think it was one of those that gave James Cashmann only 1/2 vote in one precinct (he was one of the Dover School Board pro-ID members that got voted out last year).  Which leads me to think that maybe we need even lower-tech solutions to have reliable elections (or maybe observers from third-world countries).  Apparently, Jimmy Carter, in an interview following the election in Nicaragua, was asked how that election compared to American elections, and he said American procedures just wouldn't cut it if international observers were judging them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I thought the old booths, with the curtains and the levers, were reliable, if clunky and low-tech. But I think it was one of those that gave James Cashmann only 1/2 vote in one precinct (he was one of the Dover School Board pro-ID members that got voted out last year).  Which leads me to think that maybe we need even lower-tech solutions to have reliable elections (or maybe observers from third-world countries).  Apparently, Jimmy Carter, in an interview following the election in Nicaragua, was asked how that election compared to American elections, and he said American procedures just wouldn&#8217;t cut it if international observers were judging them.</p>
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		<title>By: Carl Brannen</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21900</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl Brannen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Nov 2006 22:42:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21900</guid>
		<description>It's a lot easier for a corrupt party to modify a mail election than an in person election.  You have no verification who it was that filled out a mail-in ballot.  This fact has resulted in many dead people voting in Washington elections as has been widely reported in the newspapers here, but there is no way to tell the true depth of the problem as it is only the dead vote that is easy to detect.

If one person votes repeatedly in a walk-in election at least they have to walk from one precinct to another.  Election observers on a mail-in election have to be present at the reception of the mail for weeks or even months instead of just one day.  The elections office is a partisan office filled with employees who care deeply who wins and it is the election observers that are necessary to maintain fairness.  There is no way to prevent the US post office employees from accidentally or purposely influencing who gets ballots when, and how fast they are sent in -- another subject of much newspaper comment in Washington state when the King County election office lied to the public about when it mailed overseas ballots, mostly to US soldiers.

Countries that are new to Democracy know all these very obvious things and would never stand for mail-in elections.  Instead, they rely on simple expedients like applying ink to people's fingers when they vote and counting votes publicly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s a lot easier for a corrupt party to modify a mail election than an in person election.  You have no verification who it was that filled out a mail-in ballot.  This fact has resulted in many dead people voting in Washington elections as has been widely reported in the newspapers here, but there is no way to tell the true depth of the problem as it is only the dead vote that is easy to detect.</p>
<p>If one person votes repeatedly in a walk-in election at least they have to walk from one precinct to another.  Election observers on a mail-in election have to be present at the reception of the mail for weeks or even months instead of just one day.  The elections office is a partisan office filled with employees who care deeply who wins and it is the election observers that are necessary to maintain fairness.  There is no way to prevent the US post office employees from accidentally or purposely influencing who gets ballots when, and how fast they are sent in &#8212; another subject of much newspaper comment in Washington state when the King County election office lied to the public about when it mailed overseas ballots, mostly to US soldiers.</p>
<p>Countries that are new to Democracy know all these very obvious things and would never stand for mail-in elections.  Instead, they rely on simple expedients like applying ink to people&#8217;s fingers when they vote and counting votes publicly.</p>
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		<title>By: spyder</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21896</link>
		<dc:creator>spyder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Nov 2006 19:03:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21896</guid>
		<description>I live in WA where we vote by mail (except of course for the most populous county that is mostly Democratic and thus the GOP has slaved mightily to prevent mail voting, hoping to reduce turnout) and did so last week.  After the 2004 gubenatorial election nightmare, and the handcounting of ballots (in which i participated) many citizens feel better about believing their votes are counted.  This of course is not based on factual evidence since the tabulating machines are infact owned by Deibold and ECS.  The state central tabulator can pretty much do whatever it wants, and unless a statewide or federal issue is closer than 1% there will be no possible recount.  All a hacker need do is makes sure the tabulations are &#62;1% and voila no possibility of recount nor recourse.  Yea though we claim to live in a democratic republic, our votes belong to those who control the machines.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I live in WA where we vote by mail (except of course for the most populous county that is mostly Democratic and thus the GOP has slaved mightily to prevent mail voting, hoping to reduce turnout) and did so last week.  After the 2004 gubenatorial election nightmare, and the handcounting of ballots (in which i participated) many citizens feel better about believing their votes are counted.  This of course is not based on factual evidence since the tabulating machines are infact owned by Deibold and ECS.  The state central tabulator can pretty much do whatever it wants, and unless a statewide or federal issue is closer than 1% there will be no possible recount.  All a hacker need do is makes sure the tabulations are &gt;1% and voila no possibility of recount nor recourse.  Yea though we claim to live in a democratic republic, our votes belong to those who control the machines.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob Knop</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21897</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Knop</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Nov 2006 17:20:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21897</guid>
		<description>I either voted, or I gave Diebold permission to tell the state who I "voted" for.  I"m not really sure which.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I either voted, or I gave Diebold permission to tell the state who I &#8220;voted&#8221; for.  I&#8221;m not really sure which.</p>
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		<title>By: B</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21895</link>
		<dc:creator>B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Nov 2006 16:09:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/11/07/imagine-yourself-voting-preferably-on-paper/#comment-21895</guid>
		<description>http://itpolicy.princeton.edu/voting/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://itpolicy.princeton.edu/voting/" rel="nofollow">http://itpolicy.princeton.edu/voting/</a></p>
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