Comments on: But We Feel Good About Ourselves http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/ Random samplings from a universe of ideas. Fri, 05 Dec 2008 04:03:54 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.1 By: Savyasachi http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20993 Savyasachi Wed, 18 Oct 2006 04:46:44 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20993 Since there is no proof that science curricula in these countries were standardized, what sense does this comparison make? Since there is no proof that science curricula in these countries were standardized, what sense does this comparison make?

]]> By: damselfly http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-21009 damselfly Sun, 15 Oct 2006 06:41:12 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-21009 Sean makes the point that "...we don't train our teachers well, provide schools with proper resources, or challenge our students enough in the classroom." Some good points. But we also need to give teachers some credit. If you want to teach 8th grade math or science half the job will be dealing with the "problem" students - the child who's totally unsupervised at home & used to doing as they please, whenever they please, the child who's being bullied, the child who's doing the bullying, the chronically disruptive child, the withdrawn child who may be pregnant...just teaching won't be enough. You'll have to be a surrogate parent and social worker as well, and for that - there are no test scores. Sean makes the point that “…we don’t train our teachers well, provide schools with proper resources, or challenge our students enough in the classroom.”

Some good points. But we also need to give teachers some credit. If you want to teach 8th grade math or science half the job will be dealing with the “problem” students - the child who’s totally unsupervised at home & used to doing as they please, whenever they please, the child who’s being bullied, the child who’s doing the bullying, the chronically disruptive child, the withdrawn child who may be pregnant…just teaching won’t be enough. You’ll have to be a surrogate parent and social worker as well, and for that - there are no test scores.

]]> By: Suz http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20977 Suz Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:52:59 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20977 Thanks for the link to the incompetence article, Allyson... I've been thinking for a long time why so many incompetent people do so well (i.e. get professorships at Harvard or become presidents of Harvard, etc.) and while so many competent people aren't in better positions of power/ prestige. While it's a different topic, I think the inability to estimate one's (in)abilities is somewhat related. Thanks for the link to the incompetence article, Allyson… I’ve been thinking for a long time why so many incompetent people do so well (i.e. get professorships at Harvard or become presidents of Harvard, etc.) and while so many competent people aren’t in better positions of power/ prestige. While it’s a different topic, I think the inability to estimate one’s (in)abilities is somewhat related.

]]> By: Allyson http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-21012 Allyson Thu, 12 Oct 2006 19:25:24 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-21012 I hate being the threadkiller. I hate being the threadkiller.

]]> By: Allyson http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20979 Allyson Tue, 10 Oct 2006 14:59:35 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20979 Sara T., might as well ask why there aren't more physicists in the NBA. Sara T., might as well ask why there aren’t more physicists in the NBA.

]]> By: Florida Citizens for Science » Yet another study http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20978 Florida Citizens for Science » Yet another study Tue, 10 Oct 2006 14:38:06 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20978 [...] The blog Cosmic Variance points out yet another study about how poorly American students are doing in math and science compared to other countries. The comments in the blog post are great as they hash out the merits and failings of the report. [...] […] The blog Cosmic Variance points out yet another study about how poorly American students are doing in math and science compared to other countries. The comments in the blog post are great as they hash out the merits and failings of the report. […]

]]> By: Sara T http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20961 Sara T Tue, 10 Oct 2006 03:18:07 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20961 Okay, this IS a complicated issue, but a blog can be for ranting, right? That's the beauty in a way, part of the discussion. So, I am gonna say: A big component of the USA's dismal knowledge of and inappropriate self-confidence regarding science and engineering is HOLLYWOOD [aka Burbank and Culver City]. Or, if you want it a bit narrower, commercial TELEVISION. Even a show that at least tries to have in its premise logical investigation, like "House," always has to have the mystical, feel good, fuzzy folks WINNING, and House's crumudgeonly but scientific (including the leaps of ideas) approach seen as, okay, problem-solving, but to no good end as it screws him up. There are no scientists and engineerings producing or directing in Hollywood (I hope someone corrects me!). There are probably some folks writing, but these things never get on the screen, big or little, in the original form. Well, I'm sure this is not an original rant and I have some work to do, but felt like weighing in. A similar rant re elected officials, especially in Congress, would also be appropriate!... Okay, this IS a complicated issue, but a blog can be for ranting, right? That’s the beauty in a way, part of the discussion. So, I am gonna say:

A big component of the USA’s dismal knowledge of and inappropriate self-confidence regarding science and engineering is HOLLYWOOD [aka Burbank and Culver City].
Or, if you want it a bit narrower, commercial TELEVISION.
Even a show that at least tries to have in its premise logical investigation, like “House,” always has to have the mystical, feel good, fuzzy folks WINNING, and House’s crumudgeonly but scientific (including the leaps of ideas) approach seen as, okay, problem-solving, but to no good end as it screws him up.
There are no scientists and engineerings producing or directing in Hollywood (I hope someone corrects me!). There are probably some folks writing, but these things never get on the screen, big or little, in the original form.

Well, I’m sure this is not an original rant and I have some work to do, but felt like weighing in. A similar rant re elected officials, especially in Congress, would also be appropriate!…

]]> By: Beauty Factory http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20980 Beauty Factory Mon, 09 Oct 2006 14:28:36 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20980 <strong>자신감</strong> 최근 Cosmic Variance에 과학 교육에 관한 포스íŒ...이 올라ì™"다. 미국의 경우, '자신감만으로 충분하지 ì•Šê³  실질적인 교사 교육이나 적절한 자료 공급, 수ì—...에서의 학생 도전 유도 ë"±ì´ í•„ìš"하다'... 자신감

최근 Cosmic Variance에 과학 교육에 관한 포스팅이 올라왔다. 미국의 경우, ‘자신감만으로 충분하지 ì•Šê³  실질적인 교사 교육이나 적절한 자료 공급, 수업에서의 학생 도전 유도 딱이 필요하다’…

]]> By: Jim Harrison http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20967 Jim Harrison Sun, 08 Oct 2006 22:35:29 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20967 Let us analyze things as a chemist might. Maybe what matters in determining the scientific prowess of a country is not the average proficiency of its students or the proportion of students who are greatly proficient, but the absolute number of students who are greatly proficient. Does anybody have numbers on that? Let us analyze things as a chemist might. Maybe what matters in determining the scientific prowess of a country is not the average proficiency of its students or the proportion of students who are greatly proficient, but the absolute number of students who are greatly proficient. Does anybody have numbers on that?

]]> By: citrine http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20966 citrine Sun, 08 Oct 2006 22:13:31 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2006/10/05/but-we-feel-good-about-ourselves/#comment-20966 JC on Oct 5th, 2006 at 11:10 pm There seems to be a disconnect between American kids doing poorly in math + science, and the fact that America is relatively advanced technologically. If Americans were genuinely "stupid" and/or "lazy", then I would expect the society to resemble something like "Mad Max" and not a technologically advanced society. ******************************************************* JC, Some of the contributing factors to this maybe the larger population of the USA - which compensates to some degree the percentage distribution of skills - and the contributions to the tech workforce from immigrants. Plus the post-WWII boom may have given the USA head start in establishing labs, etc. JC on Oct 5th, 2006 at 11:10 pm

There seems to be a disconnect between American kids doing poorly in math + science, and the fact that America is relatively advanced technologically.

If Americans were genuinely “stupid” and/or “lazy”, then I would expect the society to resemble something like “Mad Max” and not a technologically advanced society.

*******************************************************

JC,

Some of the contributing factors to this maybe the larger population of the USA - which compensates to some degree the percentage distribution of skills - and the contributions to the tech workforce from immigrants. Plus the post-WWII boom may have given the USA head start in establishing labs, etc.

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