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	<title>Comments on: Is our universe natural?</title>
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	<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/</link>
	<description>Random samplings from a universe of ideas</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 23:56:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: CIPig on ID, prof&#8217;s tenure, and Cosmic Variance militancy &#171; Dudesky</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-280783</link>
		<dc:creator>CIPig on ID, prof&#8217;s tenure, and Cosmic Variance militancy &#171; Dudesky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:57:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-280783</guid>
		<description>[...] It&#8217;s interesting to see how Jo Anne acknowledges the extent of Prof Gonzalez&#8217;s science credentials: The department has denied tenure to Professor Guillermo Gonzalez. Prof Gonzalez, by all reports, is the author of nearly 70 peer-reviewed scientific papers, co-author of a major college-level astronomy textbook, his work led to the discovery of two new planets, and he has had his research featured in Science, Nature, and on the cover of Scientific American. Recently, he discovered what is known as the Galactic Habitable Zone, which essentially proposes that life forms when there is the right balance of unique conditions. A hypothesis not too different from our own discussions of the anthropic principle here in theoretical high energy physics! [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] It&#8217;s interesting to see how Jo Anne acknowledges the extent of Prof Gonzalez&#8217;s science credentials: The department has denied tenure to Professor Guillermo Gonzalez. Prof Gonzalez, by all reports, is the author of nearly 70 peer-reviewed scientific papers, co-author of a major college-level astronomy textbook, his work led to the discovery of two new planets, and he has had his research featured in Science, Nature, and on the cover of Scientific American. Recently, he discovered what is known as the Galactic Habitable Zone, which essentially proposes that life forms when there is the right balance of unique conditions. A hypothesis not too different from our own discussions of the anthropic principle here in theoretical high energy physics! [...]</p>
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		<title>By: &#8216;Tis the Season for Tenure Flaps &#124; Cosmic Variance</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-263958</link>
		<dc:creator>&#8216;Tis the Season for Tenure Flaps &#124; Cosmic Variance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 May 2007 08:00:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-263958</guid>
		<description>[...] While we&#8217;re on the subject of tenure here at CV, there is yet another tenure flap happening in the physics department at Iowa State University. Which is my alma mater (always embarrassing to admit that, so I might as well get it out of the way early on). The department has denied tenure to Professor Guillermo Gonzalez. Prof Gonzalez, by all reports, is the author of nearly 70 peer-reviewed scientific papers, co-author of a major college-level astronomy textbook, his work led to the discovery of two new planets, and he has had his research featured in Science, Nature, and on the cover of Scientific American. Recently, he discovered what is known as the Galactic Habitable Zone, which essentially proposes that life forms when there is the right balance of unique conditions. A hypothesis not too different from our own discussions of the anthropic principle here in theoretical high energy physicsâ€¦  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] While we&#8217;re on the subject of tenure here at CV, there is yet another tenure flap happening in the physics department at Iowa State University. Which is my alma mater (always embarrassing to admit that, so I might as well get it out of the way early on). The department has denied tenure to Professor Guillermo Gonzalez. Prof Gonzalez, by all reports, is the author of nearly 70 peer-reviewed scientific papers, co-author of a major college-level astronomy textbook, his work led to the discovery of two new planets, and he has had his research featured in Science, Nature, and on the cover of Scientific American. Recently, he discovered what is known as the Galactic Habitable Zone, which essentially proposes that life forms when there is the right balance of unique conditions. A hypothesis not too different from our own discussions of the anthropic principle here in theoretical high energy physicsâ€¦  [...]</p>
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		<title>By: After Reading a Child&#8217;s Guide to Modern Physics &#124; Cosmic Variance</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-130592</link>
		<dc:creator>After Reading a Child&#8217;s Guide to Modern Physics &#124; Cosmic Variance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Nov 2006 16:50:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-130592</guid>
		<description>[...] Ol&#8217; Wystan is right; we do have a better time than most of the universe. It would be no fun to constantly worry that &#8220;a lover&#8217;s kiss / Would either not be felt / Or break the loved one&#8217;s neck.&#8221; And in a sense, it&#8217;s surprising (one might almost say unnatural) that our local conditions allow for the build-up of the delicate complexity necessary to nurture passion and poetry among we creatures of median size. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Ol&#8217; Wystan is right; we do have a better time than most of the universe. It would be no fun to constantly worry that &#8220;a lover&#8217;s kiss / Would either not be felt / Or break the loved one&#8217;s neck.&#8221; And in a sense, it&#8217;s surprising (one might almost say unnatural) that our local conditions allow for the build-up of the delicate complexity necessary to nurture passion and poetry among we creatures of median size. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Rapped on the Head by Creationists &#124; Cosmic Variance</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-111488</link>
		<dc:creator>Rapped on the Head by Creationists &#124; Cosmic Variance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Aug 2006 15:11:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-111488</guid>
		<description>[...] I think this is a new category for my CV &#8212; &#8220;articles subjected to close reading by creationists.â€ (That, and pioneering the concept of the least bloggable unit.) Here is the first entry: my humble little essay for Nature entitled &#8220;Is Our Universe Natural?&#8221; has been lovingly dissected at â€œCreation-Evolution Headlines.â€ In which they claim that my paper â€œarms the intelligent design movement in the current fight over the definition of science.â€ Okay, now those are fighting words. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I think this is a new category for my CV &#8212; &#8220;articles subjected to close reading by creationists.â€ (That, and pioneering the concept of the least bloggable unit.) Here is the first entry: my humble little essay for Nature entitled &#8220;Is Our Universe Natural?&#8221; has been lovingly dissected at â€œCreation-Evolution Headlines.â€ In which they claim that my paper â€œarms the intelligent design movement in the current fight over the definition of science.â€ Okay, now those are fighting words. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The String Theory Backlash &#124; Cosmic Variance</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-34146</link>
		<dc:creator>The String Theory Backlash &#124; Cosmic Variance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Jun 2006 18:02:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-34146</guid>
		<description>[...] Of course, you do have to make the case that your personally favorite approach is a promising one, to the public and to colleagues in other specialties as well as to graduate students. This is not always a job that string theorists have done well. Some of them, I&#8217;ve heard rumors, can even occasionally be a mite arrogant. Let&#8217;s admit, this is something of an occupational hazard among academics; if universities fired all the arrogant people, the remaining faculty would be stuck teaching twenty courses a semester. And, while I think that an enormous landscape of stringy vacua might very well exist, I think that supporters of the idea have dramatically failed to take seriously the difficulty of actually calculating anything on that basis. Discussions about these crucial issues have all too often degenerated into sophomore-level philosophy-of-science debates, which haven&#8217;t done credit to either side. The truth is, we&#8217;re not doing science in a new way, it&#8217;s the same old way &#8212; trying to come up with the simplest possible consistent and coherent framework that explains the phenomena we observe. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Of course, you do have to make the case that your personally favorite approach is a promising one, to the public and to colleagues in other specialties as well as to graduate students. This is not always a job that string theorists have done well. Some of them, I&#8217;ve heard rumors, can even occasionally be a mite arrogant. Let&#8217;s admit, this is something of an occupational hazard among academics; if universities fired all the arrogant people, the remaining faculty would be stuck teaching twenty courses a semester. And, while I think that an enormous landscape of stringy vacua might very well exist, I think that supporters of the idea have dramatically failed to take seriously the difficulty of actually calculating anything on that basis. Discussions about these crucial issues have all too often degenerated into sophomore-level philosophy-of-science debates, which haven&#8217;t done credit to either side. The truth is, we&#8217;re not doing science in a new way, it&#8217;s the same old way &#8212; trying to come up with the simplest possible consistent and coherent framework that explains the phenomena we observe. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The View of the Universe from the Perimeter &#124; Cosmic Variance</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-30504</link>
		<dc:creator>The View of the Universe from the Perimeter &#124; Cosmic Variance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jun 2006 17:10:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-30504</guid>
		<description>[...] It&#8217;s remarkable how polarizing the whole idea of the string-theory landscape and the anthropic principle really is. It&#8217;s not a simple split of string theorists vs. cosmologists vs. everyone else; there are string theorists who love the lanscape, as well as ones who hate it, and likewise for cosmologists or anyone else paying attention. I&#8217;ve been arguing that the landscape/multiverse might very well exist and is interesting to think about, but that it&#8217;s absolutely impossible right now (and might always be) to use it to calculate anything, or even to sensibly re-calibrate our notions of what is &#8220;natural.&#8221; I was happy to learn that Paul Steinhardt and Neil Turok are basically in agreement with this view, and are even writing a paper that attempts to make it crystal clear that the landscape does not correctly predict the cosmological constant ala Weinberg. In fact, if we&#8217;re allowed to take it seriously at all, it makes quite a strong and vividly different prediction altogether: the cosmological constant should be quite large (many times the matter density, although presumably not at the Planck scale), and we should live in a single lonely galaxy in an empty universe dominated by vacuum energy. Their paper is in preparation, and I hope to say more about it when it comes out. In the meantime, there is serious and hard work to be done to understand the generation and evolution of cosmological perturbations, so it hasn&#8217;t all devolved into a shouting match over whether talking about unobservable parts of the universe should count as science. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] It&#8217;s remarkable how polarizing the whole idea of the string-theory landscape and the anthropic principle really is. It&#8217;s not a simple split of string theorists vs. cosmologists vs. everyone else; there are string theorists who love the lanscape, as well as ones who hate it, and likewise for cosmologists or anyone else paying attention. I&#8217;ve been arguing that the landscape/multiverse might very well exist and is interesting to think about, but that it&#8217;s absolutely impossible right now (and might always be) to use it to calculate anything, or even to sensibly re-calibrate our notions of what is &#8220;natural.&#8221; I was happy to learn that Paul Steinhardt and Neil Turok are basically in agreement with this view, and are even writing a paper that attempts to make it crystal clear that the landscape does not correctly predict the cosmological constant ala Weinberg. In fact, if we&#8217;re allowed to take it seriously at all, it makes quite a strong and vividly different prediction altogether: the cosmological constant should be quite large (many times the matter density, although presumably not at the Planck scale), and we should live in a single lonely galaxy in an empty universe dominated by vacuum energy. Their paper is in preparation, and I hope to say more about it when it comes out. In the meantime, there is serious and hard work to be done to understand the generation and evolution of cosmological perturbations, so it hasn&#8217;t all devolved into a shouting match over whether talking about unobservable parts of the universe should count as science. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: LambchopofGod</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9886</link>
		<dc:creator>LambchopofGod</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jan 2006 04:13:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9886</guid>
		<description>I just noticed that Sean's paper cites
http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/0503249

Any comment as to why that paper is relevant, Sean? :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just noticed that Sean&#8217;s paper cites<br />
<a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/0503249" rel="nofollow">http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/0503249</a></p>
<p>Any comment as to why that paper is relevant, Sean? <img src='http://cosmicvariance.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Bloggernacle Times &#187; This Week In Science and Religion</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9330</link>
		<dc:creator>Bloggernacle Times &#187; This Week In Science and Religion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Dec 2005 18:35:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9330</guid>
		<description>[...] Moving to non-Mormon blogs, the firestorm over superstring theory continues unabated. Some physicists really getting upset at how the Discovery Institute keeps trying to link Susskind&#8217;s thoughts on superstring theory with intelligent design. For a nice overview including links to a New Scientist interview, check out Not Even Wrong. Also up is a discussion of the same issues and the question of whether our universe is natural. It&#8217;s discussion that arose from the author&#8217;s Nature review. Lots of other links on this topic, but those two should get you started if you are interested. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Moving to non-Mormon blogs, the firestorm over superstring theory continues unabated. Some physicists really getting upset at how the Discovery Institute keeps trying to link Susskind&#8217;s thoughts on superstring theory with intelligent design. For a nice overview including links to a New Scientist interview, check out Not Even Wrong. Also up is a discussion of the same issues and the question of whether our universe is natural. It&#8217;s discussion that arose from the author&#8217;s Nature review. Lots of other links on this topic, but those two should get you started if you are interested. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Count Iblis</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9294</link>
		<dc:creator>Count Iblis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Dec 2005 17:39:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9294</guid>
		<description>Sean,

in your paper hep-th/0410270 with Chen, you discuss a bit about unitary time evolution. This reminded me of this problem (I don't work in this field so perhaps it is trivial):

If you start out with a region of some finite volume then presumably here are only a finite number of fundamental states available for that volume. If this region undergoes expansion and becomes larger, then shouldn't there be less degrees of freedom available per unit volume if you demand unitary time evolution?

But if one thinks of the standard model as an effective low energy theory obtained by integrating out the fundamental degrees of freedom, then this means that the coupling constants would have to change according to a renormalization group transformation.

Or is this just an artefact of treating the expansion clasically? Is the density of states in the original space time for which  the scalar field configurations are compatible with the expansion just the same as in the final space time?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sean,</p>
<p>in your paper hep-th/0410270 with Chen, you discuss a bit about unitary time evolution. This reminded me of this problem (I don&#8217;t work in this field so perhaps it is trivial):</p>
<p>If you start out with a region of some finite volume then presumably here are only a finite number of fundamental states available for that volume. If this region undergoes expansion and becomes larger, then shouldn&#8217;t there be less degrees of freedom available per unit volume if you demand unitary time evolution?</p>
<p>But if one thinks of the standard model as an effective low energy theory obtained by integrating out the fundamental degrees of freedom, then this means that the coupling constants would have to change according to a renormalization group transformation.</p>
<p>Or is this just an artefact of treating the expansion clasically? Is the density of states in the original space time for which  the scalar field configurations are compatible with the expansion just the same as in the final space time?</p>
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		<title>By: Sean</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9204</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Dec 2005 17:07:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9204</guid>
		<description>The cosmic no-hair theorem, which roughly states that an expanding universe in the presence of a positive cosmological constant will generically approach empty de Sitter space, has by no means been rigorously proven in all interesting cases.  Nevertheless, something like it is probably true, at least in an open universe.  Jennifer Chen and I argue in favor of it in our &lt;a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/0410270" rel="nofollow"&gt;first paper&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The cosmic no-hair theorem, which roughly states that an expanding universe in the presence of a positive cosmological constant will generically approach empty de Sitter space, has by no means been rigorously proven in all interesting cases.  Nevertheless, something like it is probably true, at least in an open universe.  Jennifer Chen and I argue in favor of it in our <a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/0410270" rel="nofollow">first paper</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: inflation-newcomer</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9195</link>
		<dc:creator>inflation-newcomer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Dec 2005 11:04:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9195</guid>
		<description>Sean/Mark.,
just clarify one thing.. (not exactly related to  the post)
is the cosmic no-hair conjecture proved??..
i mean.. do all initial conds (including anisotropic ones) approach the de-sitter solution ???
 Upon digging up stuff, I was not able to find agreement on this issue. Pple like Wald, G.Ellis seem to insist that this hasn't been done... while linde etc insist that it is over! And most inflation reviews and books happily use the friedman equation with (at best) just a passing comment on the issue of anisotropies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sean/Mark.,<br />
just clarify one thing.. (not exactly related to  the post)<br />
is the cosmic no-hair conjecture proved??..<br />
i mean.. do all initial conds (including anisotropic ones) approach the de-sitter solution ???<br />
 Upon digging up stuff, I was not able to find agreement on this issue. Pple like Wald, G.Ellis seem to insist that this hasn&#8217;t been done&#8230; while linde etc insist that it is over! And most inflation reviews and books happily use the friedman equation with (at best) just a passing comment on the issue of anisotropies.</p>
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		<title>By: Plato</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9177</link>
		<dc:creator>Plato</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Dec 2005 21:57:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9177</guid>
		<description>Equilibrium points unstable? I think is what Sean is saying?

Anyway I wanted to divert attention for 1 second and show the &lt;a href="http://eskesthai.blogspot.com/2005/12/human-evolution-has-no-limits.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;status of discrete functions&lt;/a&gt; in our cosmo? Does it have &lt;b&gt;sound&lt;/b&gt; reasoning?

Are topological functions natural? :) I was creatively inspired. :)

Now back to regular programming. Thanks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Equilibrium points unstable? I think is what Sean is saying?</p>
<p>Anyway I wanted to divert attention for 1 second and show the <a href="http://eskesthai.blogspot.com/2005/12/human-evolution-has-no-limits.html" rel="nofollow">status of discrete functions</a> in our cosmo? Does it have <b>sound</b> reasoning?</p>
<p>Are topological functions natural? <img src='http://cosmicvariance.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> I was creatively inspired. <img src='http://cosmicvariance.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Now back to regular programming. Thanks</p>
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		<title>By: island</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9175</link>
		<dc:creator>island</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Dec 2005 20:31:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9175</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Islandâ€“ if you want to think about the spatial geometry of the universe as an harmonic oscillator, itâ€™s an upside-down oscillator; flatness is an unstable point.

Except for accelerated expansion (ala inflation or dark energy), thereâ€™s nothing that drives spatial hypersurfaces to be flat. &lt;/I&gt;

I'm pretty sure that a balance between gravity and the expansion will accomplish that in this case, which was my point, where the simplist version of infationary theory was tacked-on to big bang theory in order to explain a lack of causal connection in the universe given the uniformity of cosmic background radiation and the size of the universe... which I just did, as well, but without the need for the bandaid theory.

Occam would tell you that causality is not violated if the universe has volume when a big bang occurs, so you should not assume idealized theoretical projections beyond that, (which require that we accept even more unproven theoretical speculation), without very hard proof, which I do not believe that you have.

I don't believe that you can prove that Einstein's static model was unstable either, since matter generation from vacuum energy in that model will cause a counterbalancing increase in negative pressure and positive gravitational curvature.  The fact that Einstein did not know about real particle potential in the quantum vacuum does not change the fact that he's still right until somebody proves him wrong, since this process causes expansion in this model.

It is easily shown that a counterbalanced increase between negative pressure and positive gravitaional curvature causes tension between the vacuum and ordinary matter to increase while the universes is held flat and stable by this effect which will lead to the previously described scenario for pre-existing volume when the forces that bind the universe give-way to the straw that breaks its back, so there will again be no violation of causilty, AGAIN... and occam is still a happy camper.

I've made this point before, but it didn't capture your interest, so I can only assume that this means that you don't see how this might affect other assumptions that have been made which are also taken for granted to disprove or supercede this model.

I disagree with that too, because the interpretations of what the evidence means change in this model, as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Islandâ€“ if you want to think about the spatial geometry of the universe as an harmonic oscillator, itâ€™s an upside-down oscillator; flatness is an unstable point.</p>
<p>Except for accelerated expansion (ala inflation or dark energy), thereâ€™s nothing that drives spatial hypersurfaces to be flat. </i></p>
<p>I&#8217;m pretty sure that a balance between gravity and the expansion will accomplish that in this case, which was my point, where the simplist version of infationary theory was tacked-on to big bang theory in order to explain a lack of causal connection in the universe given the uniformity of cosmic background radiation and the size of the universe&#8230; which I just did, as well, but without the need for the bandaid theory.</p>
<p>Occam would tell you that causality is not violated if the universe has volume when a big bang occurs, so you should not assume idealized theoretical projections beyond that, (which require that we accept even more unproven theoretical speculation), without very hard proof, which I do not believe that you have.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t believe that you can prove that Einstein&#8217;s static model was unstable either, since matter generation from vacuum energy in that model will cause a counterbalancing increase in negative pressure and positive gravitational curvature.  The fact that Einstein did not know about real particle potential in the quantum vacuum does not change the fact that he&#8217;s still right until somebody proves him wrong, since this process causes expansion in this model.</p>
<p>It is easily shown that a counterbalanced increase between negative pressure and positive gravitaional curvature causes tension between the vacuum and ordinary matter to increase while the universes is held flat and stable by this effect which will lead to the previously described scenario for pre-existing volume when the forces that bind the universe give-way to the straw that breaks its back, so there will again be no violation of causilty, AGAIN&#8230; and occam is still a happy camper.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve made this point before, but it didn&#8217;t capture your interest, so I can only assume that this means that you don&#8217;t see how this might affect other assumptions that have been made which are also taken for granted to disprove or supercede this model.</p>
<p>I disagree with that too, because the interpretations of what the evidence means change in this model, as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Sean</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9166</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Dec 2005 17:00:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9166</guid>
		<description>Lambchop-- what Count Iblis said, plus the inevitability of quantum fluctuations.  If inflation happened classically, with the inflaton simply obeying its equation of motion, it would eventually end.  But the fluctuations mean that there is always some probability that the rate of inflation increases rather than decreases.  So in a typical model, there will always be some place where inflation is still going on; it's not an add-on to the model, it's just a consequence of quantum mechanics.

Elliot-- people have thought about linking inflation and dark energy, e.g. &lt;a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/9810509" rel="nofollow"&gt;Peebles and Vilenkin&lt;/a&gt;.  But the energy scales are so fantastically different that it doesn't seem like a match made in heaven.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lambchop&#8211; what Count Iblis said, plus the inevitability of quantum fluctuations.  If inflation happened classically, with the inflaton simply obeying its equation of motion, it would eventually end.  But the fluctuations mean that there is always some probability that the rate of inflation increases rather than decreases.  So in a typical model, there will always be some place where inflation is still going on; it&#8217;s not an add-on to the model, it&#8217;s just a consequence of quantum mechanics.</p>
<p>Elliot&#8211; people have thought about linking inflation and dark energy, e.g. <a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/9810509" rel="nofollow">Peebles and Vilenkin</a>.  But the energy scales are so fantastically different that it doesn&#8217;t seem like a match made in heaven.</p>
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		<title>By: Sean</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9165</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Dec 2005 16:57:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9165</guid>
		<description>Grey--  trust me, the entropy of the universe is &lt;strong&gt;much&lt;/strong&gt; lower than it needs to be to support life.  For example, the 100,000,000,000 galaxies we don't live in seem pretty superfluous.

Island-- if you want to think about the spatial geometry of the universe as an harmonic oscillator, it's an upside-down oscillator; flatness is an unstable point.  Except for accelerated expansion (ala inflation or dark energy), there's nothing that drives spatial hypersurfaces to be flat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Grey&#8211;  trust me, the entropy of the universe is <strong>much</strong> lower than it needs to be to support life.  For example, the 100,000,000,000 galaxies we don&#8217;t live in seem pretty superfluous.</p>
<p>Island&#8211; if you want to think about the spatial geometry of the universe as an harmonic oscillator, it&#8217;s an upside-down oscillator; flatness is an unstable point.  Except for accelerated expansion (ala inflation or dark energy), there&#8217;s nothing that drives spatial hypersurfaces to be flat.</p>
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		<title>By: Elliot</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9161</link>
		<dc:creator>Elliot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Dec 2005 15:34:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9161</guid>
		<description>Sean,

Again forgive the layman's naivete here but.

Since the "inflaton" field drives the inflationary expansion and Dark Energy seems to be driving the acceleration of expansion in our universe, is there any line of reasoning that might suggest these two are related or are we talking apples and oranges here?

Thanks,

Elliot</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sean,</p>
<p>Again forgive the layman&#8217;s naivete here but.</p>
<p>Since the &#8220;inflaton&#8221; field drives the inflationary expansion and Dark Energy seems to be driving the acceleration of expansion in our universe, is there any line of reasoning that might suggest these two are related or are we talking apples and oranges here?</p>
<p>Thanks,</p>
<p>Elliot</p>
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		<title>By: Count Iblis</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9121</link>
		<dc:creator>Count Iblis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Dec 2005 00:25:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9121</guid>
		<description>LambchopofGod,

It's because the rate of expansion of the false vacuum is so extremely fast. If you start out with a small piece of false vacuum that is inflating then there is always a small probability that a piece of it won't have decayed to the normal state.

The survival probability of a piece of the false vacuum goes to zero exponentially, but the total volume of the false vacuum increases exponentially. The product of the two factors grows exponentially, so the total volume of inflating false vacuum keeps on growing forever.

See also here:

http://online.itp.ucsb.edu/online/kitp25/guth/oh/06.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LambchopofGod,</p>
<p>It&#8217;s because the rate of expansion of the false vacuum is so extremely fast. If you start out with a small piece of false vacuum that is inflating then there is always a small probability that a piece of it won&#8217;t have decayed to the normal state.</p>
<p>The survival probability of a piece of the false vacuum goes to zero exponentially, but the total volume of the false vacuum increases exponentially. The product of the two factors grows exponentially, so the total volume of inflating false vacuum keeps on growing forever.</p>
<p>See also here:</p>
<p><a href="http://online.itp.ucsb.edu/online/kitp25/guth/oh/06.html" rel="nofollow">http://online.itp.ucsb.edu/online/kitp25/guth/oh/06.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: LambchopofGod</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9116</link>
		<dc:creator>LambchopofGod</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Dec 2005 00:04:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9116</guid>
		<description>Sean said:
So every kind of vacuum that is populated by this form of inflation will generally be produced with an infinite volume.

OK,thanks! So I guess the next question is: why should we believe in inflation that is eternal rather than inflation that happens *once* after a [finite] universe was born? I've seen claims that eternal inflation is "generic" but I can't even imagine what that could mean...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sean said:<br />
So every kind of vacuum that is populated by this form of inflation will generally be produced with an infinite volume.</p>
<p>OK,thanks! So I guess the next question is: why should we believe in inflation that is eternal rather than inflation that happens *once* after a [finite] universe was born? I&#8217;ve seen claims that eternal inflation is &#8220;generic&#8221; but I can&#8217;t even imagine what that could mean&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Count Iblis</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9111</link>
		<dc:creator>Count Iblis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Dec 2005 22:26:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9111</guid>
		<description>Science, I'll reply later on your blog.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Science, I&#8217;ll reply later on your blog.</p>
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		<title>By: island</title>
		<link>http://cosmicvariance.com/2005/12/14/is-our-universe-natural/#comment-9102</link>
		<dc:creator>island</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Dec 2005 20:55:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cosmicvariance.com/?p=515#comment-9102</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;According to the criteria just described, the universe we observe seems dramatically unnatural.  The entropy of the universe isn't nearly as large as it could be, although it is at least increasing; for some reason... &lt;/i&gt;

I can never seem to wrap my head around this because it seems to me that our universe *is* the most natural configuration if you consider that flatness represent's the damping of an imperfect quantum harmonic oscillator, where non-unitary dissipative evolution prevents an inherently imbalanced density matrix from evolving inhomogeneously, since the second law dictates a tendency toward uniform mass distribution.

Entropy as a measure of the uniformity of the distribution of energy tells us that complete entropy, (with all matter and energy distributed over maximally expanded spacetime), requires the formation of far-from-equilibrium dissipative structures in order for the total mass distribution in an imperfect world to become *progressively* more-uniform, so a near-flat universe is most natural... if there is inherent asymmetry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>According to the criteria just described, the universe we observe seems dramatically unnatural.  The entropy of the universe isn&#8217;t nearly as large as it could be, although it is at least increasing; for some reason&#8230; </i></p>
<p>I can never seem to wrap my head around this because it seems to me that our universe *is* the most natural configuration if you consider that flatness represent&#8217;s the damping of an imperfect quantum harmonic oscillator, where non-unitary dissipative evolution prevents an inherently imbalanced density matrix from evolving inhomogeneously, since the second law dictates a tendency toward uniform mass distribution.</p>
<p>Entropy as a measure of the uniformity of the distribution of energy tells us that complete entropy, (with all matter and energy distributed over maximally expanded spacetime), requires the formation of far-from-equilibrium dissipative structures in order for the total mass distribution in an imperfect world to become *progressively* more-uniform, so a near-flat universe is most natural&#8230; if there is inherent asymmetry.</p>
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